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[personal profile] gurdonark


1. But what if my preferred option is neither fight, nor flight? That's when it gets tricky, it seems to me.

2. I've always been one of those people who likes other people a fair bit more than,in general, other people like me. It's not that I'm one of life's "disliked people", not at all, it's just that in general, I'm one of life's safe, "ordinary eccentric" folks. You know, the dreaded "he's a nice guy" kind of fellow. I don't excite wild fervor in people, but instead a kind of mild, minor-Jane-Austen-character fond regard. I'm one of the comfortable bits of ambient emotional furniture, which is not all that bad a place to be,but it has its limits, as do all roles. When I was single, this sometimes resulted in the sort of thing like that attractive woman from work who told me I was far too nice for her to date, because I was so upbeat. Fortunately, I had not ever intended to ask her out (particularly as she was praying to get engaged to a markedly "less nice" man who, despite being non-religious, ultimately and gracelessly pushed her away over a question of religious background. I'm always amused when one's future happiness is less important than what one's grandmother might think of one's lover's religious background), so I took the comment as a sort of harmless non-sequitur, one of those "I want to put you down a bit, but I want to do it in the nicest possible way" quick comments that is the lot of ambient furniture folks like myself to receive. Being told one is nice is a sort of tax one pays for the privilege of trying, and sometimes failing, to be authentically nice. It would require a longer post to address the "nice as a metaphor for romantically/sexually uninviting" issue, but I don't think I know anything more than anyone else does on that topic, anyway. Here I'm also tempted to put something in about how attentive nice people can be, but that sounds awfully defensive and really, fortunately, beside the point at this time in my life.

3. I find simultaneously that I almost never conform or alter my behavior in any major way to adjust for what people think, and yet I consistently worry that I'm somehow offending people by chance. The fun part of this worry is to notice that I worry much more about compliments I give than I do about potentially insulting people. "Did I somehow imply something forward I did not mean to imply?", ,or "Was I so friendly I'm going to weird someone out?". The price of a shy person's effusion is eternal soul-searching, but I still find the years make me more effusive than ever before.

4. Some people have the sort of charisma that appeals to broad masses of people. Some people are almost wholly non-charismatic, but instead work much more one to one with the folks they are close to in their lives. I've always trod that less-frequent but not really unusual third path--the path of narrow-cast charisma. Not everyone in my real life "gets" me. But those who do tend to "get me", understand me intensely, and make very deep connections with me. It leads to that curious dichotomy I think most people have, but I imagine for me it's a bit more intense than for some others. Most folks I know see me as a bit difficult to know, eccentric, and altogether harmless and somewhat likable. A few people, though, seem to have some inner switch turned on by which they can kinda skip ahead through the pages of the novel [personal profile] gurdonark and know how the mystery is solved, without the need for a Jeeves, Bunter or Watson to assist. It's kind of neat, somehow, to have this narrow vein of quartz running through the surface of one's relationships. Fortunately, the vein of folks who actively dislike me is much narrower, though quite corrosive, I suppose, in its way.

5. LJ interaction amuses in part because it is such an accelerated microcosm of all these social interactions. I make an LJ comment, and I wonder "gee, that was awfully friendly (or, in some cases, a bit argumentative)--hope I didn't come off weird", which is odd, because I am weird, really, and so why should I mind? But I want to be weird in that "good guy" way, and not weird in that "odd guy from the internet is too kind to me--what must he want?" kind of way.
Because I don't "want" anything from people on the 'net, in some way, other than perhaps simple kindness, and I'd hate to ever be thought of as "acquisitive" in that way.

6. I remember in the 60s and early 70s when the media was filled with songs about smiling on brothers and getting together and loving one another and also about buying the world a coke and imagining there was no hell below us and all that. Back then, the same folks who worried about universal coke drinkage were frequently the same people who formed cliques based on curious things like personal style/flair. The eternal brotherhood/sisterhood of long hair and bell bottom jeans, and all that. Maybe those Golden Dawn and theosophical people had a point--led everyone join the surface, exoteric structure, but save the mysteries for the initiates. Maybe people need to be cool in an "inner circle" more than they need to buy the whole world a coke. For some reason, as I type this, I think of time spent in Belize City, on a day when people were hurling curious ethnic taunts at us, but the Coca Cola was wonderful--made with real corn syrup.

7. Lately I want to rewrite my userinfo, but what would really capture me any better than the verbose thing I have now? It's like that old Broadway song, anyway, "how do you hold a moonbeam in your hand?".

8.The past few years I've tried to stretch myself into places I'd not really been--marketing a business, when marketing is anathema to me in some ways, trying to reach out a little better to people, when I have sharp loner tendencies. I've been pleased that I'm much better at all that than I thought I would be. But one project I've bitten off this year--starting a blitz chess club--has proven a challenge. How does one meet strangers and encourage them to share one's vision? I've been playing it far too safe. I must bite the bullet, rent a hotel meeting room, buy an ad in Chess Life and in the state chess magazine, and pursue my vision of a charity chess tournament. First prize? A zagnut candy bar. It's a matter of taking the plunge, though, isn't it? At worst, I'll be out a hundred dollars of room rental and some embarrassment. I imagined that with some well-placed e mails I could get the thing together without risk, sitting in the comfort of my own computer room. But now I see that human outreach requires risk, and I've got to steel myself to take some risks. It's funny how I want my interactions with strangers to be hermetically sealed, somehow, but surely I need to live my life a little less vacuum-packed. So a chess tournament it is!

9. I think that's a beauty of LJ--when the people stop being an "easy" means of having "safe" interaction with people, and they become real people, who breathe and laugh and cry and exist. I think that internet is different in quailty, but it's still, on some basic level, all too real. When one crosses the border from safety to real interaction, the fun begins.

10. I notice that two of my nephews are awkward in exactly the way I have always been, which nature/nurture issues I will leave, like a too-complex helix of DNA, for another post. I used to fret that I am a wallflower and a bridesmaid, but now I see that these roles have something to teach me, and I will learn them well, but not feel trapped anymore.

Date: 2003-10-03 11:56 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poetbear.livejournal.com
#9
an extremely good point
~paul

Date: 2003-10-04 01:23 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I thank you for the way that you faithfully read and thoughtfully comment to my posts, Paul.

Date: 2003-10-04 06:34 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poetbear.livejournal.com
often i think i am a researcher by nature
(or maybe i was a law clerk in a former
life!)
~paul

Date: 2003-10-04 06:37 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I think that you are a researcher at heart. In addition to "poet", your new titles should include "essayist".

Date: 2003-10-04 06:41 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poetbear.livejournal.com
well, thank you sir. that would probably
require a lot more editing than i've previously
done, but i did have a semester where i edited
a college newspaper(sort of a baptism of fire)
and the professor asked me to stay on and be
the editor the next semester. sometimes i
wonder which way i'd have gone had i taken him
up on it. Knockin' On Heaven's Door--Warren
Zevon.
~paul

Date: 2003-10-04 06:45 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
Well, I only know the college paper would have been good! I once was offered the chance to write a cartoon for the small town church newsletter. I cannot believe I turned that down!

But now I write, and enjoy writing. I don't think my graphic novel will be coming out any time soon, though :).

Date: 2003-10-04 07:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] poetbear.livejournal.com
that does seem strange. what a unique opportunity.
:o)~paul

Date: 2003-10-04 05:04 am (UTC)
kayre: (Default)
From: [personal profile] kayre
9. I think that's a beauty of LJ--when the people stop being an "easy" means of having "safe" interaction with people, and they become real people, who breathe and laugh and cry and exist. I think that internet is different in quailty, but it's still, on some basic level, all too real. When one crosses the border from safety to real interaction, the fun begins.

Ironically enough, I've had you on my AIM buddies list for a while, since your nick is posted. I keep watching you come and go and wondering if I should say something, or stay safely unreal.

Date: 2003-10-04 06:19 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I don't bite :). I'll have to add you to my AIM list, so I'll know when you're on screen, and I can make a similar decision :).

Date: 2003-10-04 05:45 am (UTC)
ext_3407: Dandelion's drawing of a hummingwolf (Hummingwolf by Dandelion)
From: [identity profile] hummingwolf.livejournal.com
I find simultaneously that I almost never conform or alter my behavior in any major way to adjust for what people think, and yet I consistently worry that I'm somehow offending people by chance.

You too, huh? Though I've found myself conforming more often recently for certain people, it doesn't seem to affect how worried I am about being offensive.

"gee, that was awfully friendly (or, in some cases, a bit argumentative)--hope I didn't come off weird", which is odd, because I am weird, really, and so why should I mind?

Heh. With some people, I wonder if I seem too normal for them to bother with. It's funny how that works.

Date: 2003-10-04 06:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I think "normal" and "weird" are both such difficult terms. I am very boring in so many ways, and hence 'normal' and yet I'm not entirely conventional,either, and yet, of course, "weird". I follow the rules, and all that, and hence "normal", but I am always at least slightly out of place everywhere I go, and, hence, "weird". I think ultimately one has to leave the labels behind and just be, but then one's self-consciousness still follows one, like a plague, in worry.

Date: 2003-10-04 06:48 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] watashi.livejournal.com
I love this post. I think I learned more about you in this one post than in many of your others combined. Though, I must say that one of the things I love about reading your journal is your seeming lack of fear when it comes to sharing intimate details about your life. Somehow it makes it even better to know you're not unafraid, but you post it anyway. I admire that. 3 & 4 describe me almost perfectly. Whenever I post something like that in someone's journal, I wonder if it's wrong that we read other people's journals and search for something that sounds like us. Or is that the whole reason people post on a public journal in the first place; to hear other people say "Yes, I'm like that, too" and verify that we are not so alone in the universe nor so strange as we often feel?

Anyway...lovely post :)

Date: 2003-10-04 06:58 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I'm glad you liked the post, and glad you commented. I think that it's very human to hunt for people "just like us" in other folks' journal posts. I like the story about the eBay auction service's early days. It taught collectors a lot of things, but one thing it taught is that some "rare" things were not so rare at all. The example I always hear used is the Cal Ripken baseball card for his first year in baseball, the so-called "rookie card". Among collectors, pre-eBay, these cards hit great heights of value. Post-eBay, tons of them turned up on auction, and they weren't really all that rare at all. I think that LJ is great for teaching me that while I sometimes imagine myself a Cal Ripken card, there's probably at least one person I really connect with in every city.

I am always amazed at how much I am willing to journal, particularly as I keep strict boundary lines on what I write about (no kvetching/triumphalism about spouse, nothing about clients, etc.). I've always called my journal a "musical comedy" after a Wodehouse quote I like to the effect that some novelists get to the heart of things and don't give a damn, but he preferred his to be musical comedies. But I'm amazed how much one can stick in the sentimental ballads, even in a musical. Thanks for reading, and for commenting.

Date: 2003-10-04 07:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] niyabinghi.livejournal.com
"I think that's a beauty of LJ--when the people stop being an "easy" means of having "safe" interaction with people, and they become real people, who breathe and laugh and cry and exist.'

What a lovely post -- thank you.

A hang up I have to get over -'is this post amusing enough'? Not everything isn life is amusing.

Date: 2003-10-04 11:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
Thanks for commenting. I know just what you mean about being humorous enough, although for me, there's a certain "rightness" I feel about a post, and when I don't have it, it bothers me. I like to play a lot with different topics and formats, and I like to be eclectic. I'm still amazed how much the same my journal sounds, no matter what I'm writing about. I am also intrigued lately that my journal has taken on more of a navel-gazing tone, which I'd always hoped I'd avoid :). It's such fun to read other journals, to see how other folks solve these same dilemmae!

Date: 2003-10-04 03:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] niyabinghi.livejournal.com
Heh --- isn't it all one big navel-gazing fest here on LJ, though>? Except there's text version video cameras in our navels?

Those journals that tend to never talk about themselves, i.e., only discuss politics or what the neighbors are doing, or what have you, tend to get boring, to me. I want to read about the nuts and bolts of people, no matter how flawed. It's such a relief to this shallow, shallow surface-sliding world.....

Date: 2003-10-04 10:07 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daisydumont.livejournal.com
like the others, i relate to this post. i think we exchanged thoughts once before about compulsive niceness (or similar)? i have worries of these kinds too, but in my case there's often a sharp struggle inside between rough honesty and diplomatic politeness. i always go with the latter, because i *need* to be nice, or at least seen as nice, but then i fret over my motives!

Date: 2003-10-04 11:36 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I have what I think of as "that southern gift" of saying almost anything provided I can say it in the right tone of voice and context. My wife, who is midwestern, says that talking about religion or politics with people far to one's right is a challenge, but I've never really found it that hard. It's in how one says it.

But I do know about that feeling of being "too nice"--it's a battle, sometimes. Thanks so much for commenting, and for reading.

(deleted comment)

Date: 2003-10-04 06:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
During my LA decade, I was an officer for a while in the Wilshire Chess Society, which sponsored a tournament a month at Westside Pavilion. It was, credit to M. Jeffreys, its president, the perfect club. It ran ONE, count it, ONE G/45 3 rounder a month, on the fourth Sunday, it had dirt cheap room rental at a mall community room, it had little dues, no politics, and tourneys which were great fun.

But like all great things, it didn't last. Oh, the club is still there, and Michael does a great job with it, I'm sure. But I became less involved (in addition to a move from the westside to the Crescenta Valley) when it tried to do things like have weekly meetings to play skittles and function more like a "club". To me, chess works best when it is just one thing I do in my life--I've never, since college anyway, had any interest in chess AS my life. It's no coincidence that my rating hit its highest point (1820 or so) during these laissez-faire once a month tourney times. I do miss getting together with Michael to play casually, though--that was fun. I noticed in the latest rating lists he's put on 500 points since I was 1800 and he was 1200, while I've lost 75 or so.

Dallas has a great chess club, and one in Watauga, a Ft. Worth suburb, has a tourney this weekend. But my vision of a blitz club is one in which tourneys, like our old Wilshire Chess Society tourneys, take place in less than 3 hours. My belief is that the reason why adult membership in USCF has declined is that so many of us see chess as one of many things we do in a weekend, not something we wish to spend a whole day or even weekend doing anymore. I want a blitz club which starts a tourney at G/5 (WBCA) or G/10 (USCF), so that one finishes by noon and has a "life".
I guess I see chess as a hobby--darn it, I'll never hit 2000 :).

I do not wish to boast, but it does turn out I am a very good lawyer. I practice in a right "thought-y" area of law, much more issues of law than jury sympathy. I'm rather like a Colle System--I look quite passive, but I really have an attack in mind.

thanks for commenting. I know just what you mean about watching and waiting. Hey, I've been following your musical posts lately--do you feel more like an "attacker" than a "watcher" when you record alone rather than with a partner?

(deleted comment)

Date: 2003-10-05 06:09 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
Now that I've finally signed up for FICS, then I'll have to download a bit of their client software. Oh, and figure out how to censor the 13 year olds.

I never know whether I'm going to beat someone until I play them. I'll look forward to playing you.

Date: 2003-10-04 10:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] http://users.livejournal.com/_riomaggiore/
i never assume or read your post as one who is being "safe." YOU are a great inspiration an example of one who expresses the daily with the cognitive.
second guessing ourselves is one of the great destroyers of our spunk, creativity and passion for growth. you faithfully exhibit that quest for life in all circumstances.
thanks for your posts.

Date: 2003-10-05 06:11 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I'm touched. Thank you.

Date: 2003-10-05 07:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] blue-by-you.livejournal.com
The fun part of this worry is to notice that I worry much more about compliments I give than I do about potentially insulting people. "Did I somehow imply something forward I did not mean to imply?", or "Was I so friendly I'm going to weird someone out?".

I do this ALL the time. I never give compliments unless I mean them but they come so unbidden from my mouth--the moment I see eyes that catch me off guard, whatever it is--I say it. And then, of course, the more you say and the less they say back, it becomes an awkward unbalanced exchange. I worry about that a lot actually -- talking too much. Needing too much. (Which isn't the same thing as the compliments but you reminded me).

Date: 2003-10-06 03:56 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
Yes, it's that sense of unbalance that gets to me. Then I think about how much I "tote up" in life, and "toting up" can be healthy or it can be narrow, and I'm having to stop and think abot which is which, and then I am worried at third remove from the compliment :).

Date: 2003-10-06 02:00 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] milly-bogtrot.livejournal.com
well you know i've been musing over the same sorts of issues recently ;)

i identify with #3 especially...i often berate myself for backspacing over something that could offend or alienate people. more and more now i'm leaving things in with the thought 'it's my journal, my opinions - if they don't like it, they can scroll', and if someone doesn't like my opinions then it seems that we're not the same kind of people after all and it's probably best if we don't mingle. it's hard, but as i get older i'm much less concerned with having everyone like me - because in the end, if they're liking me only for the 'edited' version, they don't like 'me'.

Date: 2003-10-06 03:58 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
This comment really caught me where I live, because I think in one sense I changed the content of my journal in light of someone being offended, when the problem was not that the subject matter in question was conventionally offensive, but that the person was unduly offended.

of course, my clueless art posts also gather dozens of "you don't know what you're saying" comments, ,but that's a different matter.

I hereby resolve to journal less self-consciously :)

Date: 2003-10-06 08:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] milly-bogtrot.livejournal.com
woohoo! i look forward to hearing the undiluted gurdonark :)

i remember a post you made that you ended up sort of apologising for not long ago, and at the time i couldn't see why you were apologising for what you think (apart from the fact that i personally think it was misinterpreted from the start anyway).

i always invite discussion on topics i rant/muse/joke about - i love a good debate - but ultimately someone isn't going to comment on my journal and change my opinions by doing so. 'discussion' vs 'argument'. in most cases noone's 'right' and 'wrong' anyway so it's a waste of breath :)

Date: 2003-10-06 08:27 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
That post about which I apologized, as well as another post that got me dropped by someone I liked, may have both set me back a bit in terms of being as open as I like to be. As to the apology, I was mostly trying to address some stereotypic insensivity in the way I expressed myself, although, sadly, I think that my readers read into the post more negative material than I actually put in there.
But as to the other matter, I felt badly because I said something that was really at the core of who I am, and yet offended someone without really being, if you take my meaning, offensive.

People are so diverse, and I confess to the sin of wanting to be a bit univeral and liked :).

Date: 2003-10-07 03:30 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] milly-bogtrot.livejournal.com
...and in their very diversity it is more or less ensured that you'd need to be a multiple personality for *everyone* to like you :)

Date: 2003-10-07 04:02 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
Yes. I keep confusing "universalist" with "universally liked". I'm trapped on the playground yet :).

Date: 2003-10-06 07:10 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] schpahky.livejournal.com
I am right there with you on #5. Depending on who you talk too, people either think I am sparkly, charismatic and brazenly honest or somewhat aloof, nice, and difficult to know. I've never been able to figure out who gets what side of me, except perhaps kindred spirits recognize each other and draw each other out.

This post was really good to read, thank you. Ten years ago I was doing a lot of work on small talk, trying to see what it was like to be socially forthcoming and at ease. It paid me well but as I get older I am more and more reconciled to sitting back, being shy, and embodying the paradox of changeable charisma. It's good to see how that might deepen in time.

Date: 2003-10-06 07:52 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I've always meant to take one of those "small talk" classes, because in the main "small talk" eludes me altogether. I engage in a fair bit of it, but I never quite master the art of making small talk with strangers. I really believe in kindred spirits--or perhaps in subtle cues not easy to identify.



Date: 2003-10-06 11:04 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] serendipoz.livejournal.com
That post about which I apologized, as well as another post that got me dropped by someone I liked, may have both set me back a bit in terms of being as open as I like to be. As to the apology, I was mostly trying to address some stereotypic insensivity in the way I expressed myself, although, sadly, I think that my readers read into the post more negative material than I actually put in there. But as to the other matter, I felt badly because I said something that was really at the core of who I am, and yet offended someone without really being, if you take my meaning, offensive.

I have sympathy for your care and concern for your listeners (and friends), but I think of lj as a view into another person (in this case you) life and integrity. And as such I prize the places where the lj writer voices himself. Insulting the reader, seems to me, to be more on the reader than the writer. Which doesn't mean *I* don't get insulted, but more I try to use my feelings to broaden my vision of reality.

Thanks for thinking of us, though.

Date: 2003-10-07 04:02 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gurdonark.livejournal.com
I think I tread a slightly different ground on this. I agree that self-editing content to be "nice" is a mistake, and one I freely confess I've made. I think it's important to "voice myself", and I feel in the last month or two I've self-edited a bit, after two experiences in which readers were offended by things I thought not that offensive. Your comment helps me think about this, and take a different tack, though. It's like that fellow Lewis who said that whenever he tried to offend, he failed miserably, but he managed to offend with a chance comment consistently.

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